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Boiling Frogs

Discussion in 'Other' started by fschmidt, Jan 6, 2018.

  1. fschmidt

    fschmidt Active Member

    Ruryse, you do realize that these 3 things are just part of human nature and will never change?

    softboober, thank you for using Dawkins to illustrate my previous point:
     
  2. Ruryse

    Ruryse Active Member

    Yes, and that's the point. Today's modern culture is like any of those past religions. People keep doing the same things over and over, with different flavours.

    Not to defend Islam or religions in general, but there are very intelligent parts and also incredibly stupid parts in most if not all of them. One can argue over the different brilliance-stupidity ratios of religions, but writing any of them off in its entirety is just as superficial as stating that they're the ultimate answer.
     
  3. fschmidt

    fschmidt Active Member

    The difference is that religion uses these 3 motivations for good ends, while modern culture doesn't.

    The ultimate answer is whatever necessary thing you are missing. If you have no water, then water is the ultimate answer. If you can't sleep, then sleep is the ultimate answer. And if you don't have a functional religion, then religion is the ultimate answer.
     
  4. Ruryse

    Ruryse Active Member

    Good ends for whom? It depends on the individual. One person's good might be another one's terrible. People who get rich off religion or modern culture will consider these things good. The deluded majority of people that are taken advantage of while stagnating on Level I of what they call Positive Disintegration will also consider one or both of these things good.

    This false premise sounds exactly like "If you don't have cancer, cancer is the ultimate answer." Religion is as necessary as cancer is, even if they turn out to be inevitable.
     
  5. softboober

    softboober Active Member

    Isn't what he saying regarding the rigidity and closed-mindedness of Islam with virtually no room for questioning true though?
     
  6. Ruryse

    Ruryse Active Member

    Depends on what kind of Islam we're talking about. For example, check out these Sufi teachings. Quite a striking resemblance to Buddhism, isn't it? Also, how far is the Divine Feminine (also mentioned under point 7. in the previous article I linked to) from the evil, misogynist Muslim depicted by many, including Dawkins?
     
    softboober likes this.
  7. fschmidt

    fschmidt Active Member

    Society. We have discussed this before, so I don't think we will get anywhere here either. But I believe, based on history, that a sound religion is required for the health of a society, just as water and sleep are required for personal health.

    I hate Sufism. More encouragement for morons to invent nonsense in their dysfunctional minds. Thankfully my mosque leans Salafist and they hate Sufism as much as I do.

    No. The most rigid and closed-minded culture that I have ever seen is today's modern culture which Dawkins is a part of. I wouldn't call Islam open-minded, it is somewhere in the middle. But any group that can tolerate me obviously has some degree of tolerance.
     
  8. Ruryse

    Ruryse Active Member

    What is it that you think is so hard to tolerate about you?
     
  9. fschmidt

    fschmidt Active Member

    Because I think for myself, I don't just accept the beliefs of a group. Modern culture can't tolerate debate about their basic principles, but Islam can.
     
    Ruryse likes this.
  10. Ruryse

    Ruryse Active Member

    That's one of the most admirable traits a person can have. If such a person doesn't make their own happiness dependent on other people, he will be rewarded with a beautiful, fulfilling life.
     
  11. fschmidt

    fschmidt Active Member

    Humans are tribal, and I am human. The only way I can think of to not make my happiness dependent on other people is to make my happiness dependent on opium.
     
  12. fschmidt

    fschmidt Active Member

    I don't listen to current music but I just looked up the current most popular music and here are the top 3:





    What is striking here is how completely unimaginative this music is. This is the music of a brain-dead conformist culture. Compare with the type of popular music I remember from when I was younger:



    This is the music of an open creative culture. That culture is completely gone.
     
  13. Ruryse

    Ruryse Active Member

    It's a choice to either cling to these self-limiting concepts or let them go.
     
  14. Ruryse

    Ruryse Active Member

    There is still music like that, only it's not the mainstream anymore. Someone somewhere decided it was harder to monetize than the recent examples you posted. The music business as it's been known for decades has almost completely finished its own collapse (which by itself wouldn't be bad news), but the whole thing was helped tremendously by the reigning internet monopolies. Google/YouTube can manipulate what's popular and what isn't.
     
  15. softboober

    softboober Active Member

    Would you call yourself a neoreactionary?
     
  16. fschmidt

    fschmidt Active Member

    No. Neoreactionaries want to return to medieval culture and they hate the Enlightenment. I love the Enlightenment and I don't like medieval culture. The neoreactionaries are much more compatible with modern culture than I am because modern culture is similar to medieval culture in many respects, but modern culture has absolutely nothing in common with the Enlightenment.
     
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  17. softboober

    softboober Active Member

    I thought the Theonomists in that article were very similar to how I interpreted your goals.
     
  18. fschmidt

    fschmidt Active Member

    Neoreactionary Christians are mostly Catholic and sometimes Orthodox, and almost never support the Reformation (Protestant and Anabaptist). I don't like Catholicism much, though of course nothing is as bad as modern culture. I oppose monarchy and/or theocracy as does the Old Testament. And I support religious freedom which Catholicism has traditionally opposed.

    Early America (late 1700s) is close to my ideal society. Note that everyone today hates this culture. Liberals hate it. Neoreactionaries hate it. Conservatives are embarrassed by it. Of course this makes sense since we live in a world composed of different groups of scum, and what would unite them is hating anything good.
     
  19. softboober

    softboober Active Member

    Libertarians do like that era though, don't they?
     
  20. fschmidt

    fschmidt Active Member

    Yes but for political and economic reasons, not for cultural reasons. I am sympathetic to libertarians, and if I could be bothered to vote, I would vote for them. But I can't be bothered to vote because politics and economics don't matter in a failed culture. So my point stands, no one today likes early American culture. (Libertarians don't care about culture.)
     
    Last edited: Jan 23, 2018

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