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Are Bonobos like Modern Western Societies?

Discussion in 'Nature' started by Ruryse, Sep 27, 2017.

  1. Ruryse

    Ruryse Active Member

    Bonobos and common chimpanzees have a 99.6% genetic similarity. Among modern humans (Homo sapiens sapiens), there's a genetic similarity of 99.9%. So bonobos and chimpanzees are very similar, kind of like two separate, distinct tribes, if you will. But the bonobo society and behavior is much different from that of chimpanzees.

    bonobo-vs-chimp-differences.jpg

    Bonobos have lower sexual dimorphism, i.e. the males look less different from the females. They are highly social (one could say they're more extraverted than common chimps), with groups of dominant females as leaders, and there's high sexual "freedom" which includes high levels of promiscuity and homosexuality. On the other hand, bonobos don't use near as many tools as chimps, and such occasions are not as frequent either. They're also less territorial, with looser social boundaries, and they hardly ever cooperate when it comes to hunting.

    Don't these traits and trends look all too familiar? And the bonobo society is not collapsing... yet.
     
  2. ListenNighGlint

    ListenNighGlint Active Member

    Yes... but why do you think it's just the West? Maybe the West shows it more openly but the rest also do it behind the curtains... :) And there are a lot more chimps than bonobos... and the two species only mix in captivity. Try to say the same about humans. :)
     
  3. Ruryse

    Ruryse Active Member

    Even doing it behind curtains is different from doing it openly. But that's not just what I've observed. The differences in central, strong influences (news, media, internet, government, economy, etc.) result in quick social and behavioral changes in the majority of any given society.
     
  4. Ruryse

    Ruryse Active Member

    Seems like a perfect example of Assortative Mating to me (and we can consider them one species together, going by the extremely high genetic similarity). Humans naturally do the same.
     
  5. softboober

    softboober Active Member

    But it's about 10 times smaller than common chimp society. And chimps have larger heads. :p Although it's debated, there's at least some correlation between brain size and general intelligence, especially if the shape of the brain is the same or at least very similar, like in our case.
     
    Ruryse likes this.
  6. Ruryse

    Ruryse Active Member

    That's a good point. Cro-Magnons had larger skulls than modern human skulls, so larger brain size is assumed for them. Does that mean they were more intelligent than current humans? Results of the greater evolutionary pressure? Bonobos do live in a less harsh and more abundant environment compared to chimps, after all. Imagine you're dropped in Northern territories and have to survive with using only what you can find. Would you be able to compete against a Cro-Magnon human without all the amount of technology we have accumulated throughout the centuries? That might be something like how chimpanzees have this innate ability for tool use, while bonobos don't.
     
  7. ListenNighGlint

    ListenNighGlint Active Member

    Sorry I just can't imagine that when such a quick change happens, people honestly become different all of a sudden... to me it means they already carried those traits, it just gets a new color or something.
     
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  8. andersonnnunes

    andersonnnunes Active Member


    I wonder for how much longer monkeys and bonobos will have to suffer domination by the chimps before the commies decide to intervene to end that class warfare and liberate the poor under-class from their blatantly and offensive territorial oppression.

    (Not really, but if they did, them I could give them the benefit of the doubt that their plans could work for humans.)
     
    Ruryse likes this.
  9. Ruryse

    Ruryse Active Member

    That's the funny thing, that bonobos and common chimps live in different communities separated by the Congo River, there's no chimp domination. I think humans naturally do that as well, unless (or even when) they're forced to do otherwise.
     
  10. Ruryse

    Ruryse Active Member

    I think we're saying basically the same thing, only with different words. I don't believe in a sudden genetic change either, although there are examples of fairly quick such changes. But it's more like a change of influence that triggers whatever behavioral potential is already carried by the masses. In that sense, the influence has great importance, and with that, I'm giving a lot of credit to what @fschmidt is saying regarding religion and the likes. And with long periods of environmental and social influences, certain genetic changes will crystallize and get stuck in.
     
  11. softboober

    softboober Active Member

    Possibly. Domestication results in lower intelligence, smaller brain size etc. For example, wolves are more intelligent than dogs.
     
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  12. Ruryse

    Ruryse Active Member

    Who domesticated humans? Themselves? Part of themselves?
     
  13. ListenNighGlint

    ListenNighGlint Active Member

    Aliens...? :)
     

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